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Stuart Finley: South Florida's freshwater has done much overall good. William Ross McCluney: Essentially, what's happened is we couldn't possibly support

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the size of population we have in South Florida without these controls, because most of the area has an historic times,

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been inundated with water, several feet deep in water. and only the coastal ridge has in the past been, shall we say,

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inhabitable without modification. The higher pinelands that we have around the Miami area. But as man has come to South Florida,

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he's filled up these inhabitable portions and sought to expand his his development and agriculture and and residences into the swamp areas.

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And as a result, has drained them and lowered the water levels all over. The result being that we don't have the kind of water that we need.

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And the canals that are used to drain this water and send it out to sea have the unfortunate side effect of lowering the water table in many cases,

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which during drought times can be critical. And as far as our water supply is concerned, last spring, we had one of the worst droughts that

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South Florida has ever experienced. Stuart Finley: Typically when man tries to manage nature, it turns into a mutual disaster. In the case of South Florida and it's canals,

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it can mean more intense drought when there's not enough rain, more flooding than usual when there's too much.

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Other effects are becoming obvious. The Everglades, which extend from Lake Okeechobee north of Miami to Florida's tip,

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has been seriously altered. The Everglades National Park, while apparently not seriously damage is showing the effects of

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the changes in direction and amounts of its freshwater supplies. William Ross McCluney: There have been some declines. Sloughs that were very rich and productive,

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both in natural vegetation and in waterfowl, have lost their productivity and lost the number of species and populations of

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species that they once had. It's the sort of thing that people say can recover if the water, is not an irreversible thing yet,

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if the water's replaced or returned to the Everglades. But with increasing demands of people in the area for water,

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this doesn't seem to be a great likelihood. Stuart Finley: There are other sides to South Florida's water problems. One being what to do with

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wastewater after it's been given conventional treatment to clean it up at least partially. In South Florida,

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the proposal has been made that treated wastewater be pumped into the Everglades, to help make up for the freshwater it's losing.

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But there are uncertainties, such as how much water can be pumped into the Everglades are what kinds of nutrients

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they do or do not need. William Ross McCluney: And no one has yet resolved what level of of treatment will be necessary to allow this recycled water

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to be discharged to the Everglades without harm to it. There have been some groups in town that are very violently opposed to

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a certain sewage treatment plant in its certain location because it seemed to threaten their their residential area and they've jumped on

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the recycling bandwagon and insist that we must immediately rush into recycling sewage from such a plant into the Everglades.

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But several scientists that, that know about these things are very cautious. They feel that this, this might cause

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very adverse reactions in the Everglades and that we need to do some pilot studies before we jump into something quickly.

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Stuart Finley: The South Florida situation is a neat microcosm of the environmental problems that plague many, if not most parts of the United States.

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The symptoms are sharper in Florida, because the population pressures on the land are so much greater. There is fierce debate going on now

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between environmentalists as to whether it is simply people or the pollution potential of the way we make things that is responsible for

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our environmental pickle. In Florida, it may be a bit of both. But even Mr. McCluney's opponents agree that something must

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be done to control the population growth of South Florida. William Ross McCluney: The main dispute centers around what level of population can we accept?

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What is the carrying capacity of the land? And that's where the dispute arises. Several of my associates feel that we've reached the limit in South Florida,

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in fact, even in the country. And perhaps we should even go backwards a little bit in population. Other people feel

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that we could double the population of the country without the slightest bit of trouble. Well, it, it's partially one of aesthetics,

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but it's also one of survival. But because on the aesthetic question, matter, what do you want your landscape to look like?

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On the survival question, you destroy too many of the natural areas and you destroy the things that we need to live. Stuart Finley: How does a state or region such as

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South Florida keep its population to a manageable levels, whatever they may be? Some states such as Colorado

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are actively discouraging people from settling there. Hawaii has put a limit on the number of automobiles.

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Mr. McCluney would like to see Florida slow or stop the expansion of necessary services, water, electricity, and the like,

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in response to rising populations. William Ross McCluney: If we could limit the services before it's forced upon us, then this would discourage

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people from coming here. This is a fairly drastic measure, but it's something that we're trying to work out in the state after all,

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if you're going to run out of water in the year 2000 as one Corps of Engineers report suggested, first,

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or maybe they said 1980 as a matter of fact, than it maybe that would be the first place to start. I'm in favor of increasing the rates

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for the use of these important in short, shortage commodities like electricity and water has an incentive for people to use less of it.

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And if rates go high enough, then this could eventually get discouraged people from moving here. Stuart Finley: Ross McCluney, even though he's putting

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both heart and valuable time into trying to do something about the situation in Florida isn't terribly optimistic that

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things will improve significantly. Oh, there'll be some changes, perhaps a more rational policy toward the Everglades,

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a slowdown to relentless canal ability and so on. But these small steps he feels maybe in the long run,

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both deceptive and damaging. William Ross McCluney: Perhaps what we need is a major crisis, actually an environmental colossal tragedy that's directly attributable

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to a past environmental mistake. One mistake and orientation. Something that will be sufficiently great in magnitude to wake

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people up to divert their attentions from their day-to-day concern for materialistic gain and reward and, and be sufficiently great

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in magnitude so that they're afraid for their material lives. And they see that they are direct environmental threats.

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And only then do I think we will get the kind of major massive national reforms we need. The tragedy of the whole

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environmental movement is I don't think such crises are likely. It's the old problem of we will go out not with a bang but with a whimper.

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Stuart Finley: Today, a report on the environmental problems of South Florida. Featured was William Ross McCluney,

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a graduate student at the University of Miami. If you'd like a free transcript of today's program, or

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information on how to obtain cassette tapes of Men and Molecules, please write to Men and Molecules. Post Office Box 19210,

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Washington DC, 20036. That's Men and Molecules, [Music fades in and plays underneath voice] Post Office Box 19210, Washington DC, 20036.

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Please ask for transcript number 604. This is Stuart Finley reminding you to listen in again when this station

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and the American Chemical Society present another broadcast of Men and Molecules. [Music plays and fades out]